It is very clear by your posts here and the mediators reccommendation that you need therapy. The same posts also show signs of a personality disorder. You have opportunities for a relationship with your child and yet you do everything possible to sabotoge your realtionsip with your son. Is the mediator aware of your most recent marriage? How many is that now, at least three marriages and 1 affair. And when all is said and done, your smokes are a higher priority over your child and health.
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Too Afraid To Go To Hearing Today
- Thread starter MsTKirk
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PS....my son knew that there was a possibly a chance that I would fold and it wasn't because I was giving up on doing what was best for him. Just to let you all know, I'm leaving out all the minor details of the father bashing me with lie after lie after lie. I have felt that everything he has been accusing me of and/or doing..is in reality him, describing himself to the T.
I refuse to lie, as he has no issue in doing (and he's damn good at it), but I've been told that the reason for his winning thus far, is because of how he is able to keep his cool and calm demeanor, as for myself, keeping my emotions under control, as the mediator allows him 1 1/2 to exagerate, lie, twist and manipulate..decribing a person that I am not. Again, an hour and half of Mom bashing brang tears streaming, not uncontrollably, but still flowing endlessly and then for the mediator to say "How would you like to defend yourself to his accustions?" I said.."By running home and hiding, because he is scaring me for even wanting to attack me rather than my motherhood to our son, what's at issue here?" and...I walked out of mediation, the mediator and I met the following week, to finish the session. She felt online use and soda drinking was the underlining issues for bad parenting abilities, good thing was I was no longer smoking.
Ok, enough babbling on by me...THANK YOU..whether good or bad comments from you all, it is all helpful and encouraging to me, I'm not offended by comment offered, but only thankful it was said.
I refuse to lie, as he has no issue in doing (and he's damn good at it), but I've been told that the reason for his winning thus far, is because of how he is able to keep his cool and calm demeanor, as for myself, keeping my emotions under control, as the mediator allows him 1 1/2 to exagerate, lie, twist and manipulate..decribing a person that I am not. Again, an hour and half of Mom bashing brang tears streaming, not uncontrollably, but still flowing endlessly and then for the mediator to say "How would you like to defend yourself to his accustions?" I said.."By running home and hiding, because he is scaring me for even wanting to attack me rather than my motherhood to our son, what's at issue here?" and...I walked out of mediation, the mediator and I met the following week, to finish the session. She felt online use and soda drinking was the underlining issues for bad parenting abilities, good thing was I was no longer smoking.
Ok, enough babbling on by me...THANK YOU..whether good or bad comments from you all, it is all helpful and encouraging to me, I'm not offended by comment offered, but only thankful it was said.
Please , as my son put it so eloquently and blunt . the ones that were hurt the most were us kids .
If you are the decent Parent , turn the other cheek , fight for your Mother/child relationship , or go on hurting your son . Your vindictiveness toward this child's father is controlling your emotions .
Emotions & animosity toward the other Parent have NO legal Bearing in the Court of Law .
I'm tired of hearing of all this nonsense .
If you do not Love and care for this child , just because he happened out of a affair , that is pathetic .
Sorry you have been given excellent advice here , either take it or leave it , but you are only hurting this child weather you realize it in your mental state or not .
Tough Love , women .
Inquiry123
Member
Free Advice
Maybe I'm not understanding you properly -- It sounds like you're driving with at least one of the children when you hit 100mph. When you're cited for this specific behavior, you might expect to have your ex's motion to have the court order that ANY visitation be in a supervised setting.MsTKirk said:
The " 100+ mph " remark, was a figure of speech, meaning I felt "pressured" to make sure both of my son's weren't feeling any repercussion of my shared custody, due to my youngest son's situation. I don't even think my '89 Ford Areostar Minivan is capable of doing 65 mph.
Obviously, I have given everyone a misconception about my situation due to how I express myself within typed text...Do you think we all could have a "conference call" so I can clear my name? just kiddin', although...no nevermind
Obviously, I have given everyone a misconception about my situation due to how I express myself within typed text...Do you think we all could have a "conference call" so I can clear my name? just kiddin', although...no nevermind
Oh, my. I think I like the child support forum a lot more all of a sudden...
If judges and mediators have, on multiple occasions and independent of each other, ordered the visitation/custody the way that they have and therapy has been recommended, there is obviously a reason. I somehow doubt that computer use was the sole factor in therapy being brought up, or soda drinking. Is it possible that there is an actual computer addiction, where your computer use is your ONLY social outlet and consumes large quantities of your time?
Anyhoo... *rubs temples*
From what I can make out of all this, I would have to agree with Blonde Lebinese when she said you're letting your negative feelings for your ex control how you act toward your child... bit of creative paraphrasing there
. Not taking your son's phone call, well, that was just lovely. It sounds like he's got a good heart, but you abuse it long enough by ignoring him *as in this situation* or putting your needs in front of his and you'll not only damage him, you'll ruin any chance you have at a relationship with him. Not showing up in court because you 'knew' you'd lose? I'm biting my tongue on a remark about the psychic hotline here...
I also agree that it sounds like the safety of your children when you're behind the wheel is an issue. Children aren't meant to be passengers in cars attempting to drive warp 9...
Get thee to therapy.
If judges and mediators have, on multiple occasions and independent of each other, ordered the visitation/custody the way that they have and therapy has been recommended, there is obviously a reason. I somehow doubt that computer use was the sole factor in therapy being brought up, or soda drinking. Is it possible that there is an actual computer addiction, where your computer use is your ONLY social outlet and consumes large quantities of your time?
Anyhoo... *rubs temples*
From what I can make out of all this, I would have to agree with Blonde Lebinese when she said you're letting your negative feelings for your ex control how you act toward your child... bit of creative paraphrasing there
. Not taking your son's phone call, well, that was just lovely. It sounds like he's got a good heart, but you abuse it long enough by ignoring him *as in this situation* or putting your needs in front of his and you'll not only damage him, you'll ruin any chance you have at a relationship with him. Not showing up in court because you 'knew' you'd lose? I'm biting my tongue on a remark about the psychic hotline here...I also agree that it sounds like the safety of your children when you're behind the wheel is an issue. Children aren't meant to be passengers in cars attempting to drive warp 9...
Get thee to therapy.
HOLY MOLY!!!...either one of two things has happened, I explained my situation in too much detail that those that read up, couldn't keep up with the Springer Show logistics of it all or, I truly am glad I didn't go to today's hearing because this is what I feared most!! (ex: bashing in this forum)
Lemme try this one more time...giving those minor details I was telling you about.
Father: him
Mother: ME (yes, mother had an extra-marital affair, creating the child mentioned throughout--husband/wife and other man, came to terms with the ordeal and co-parented together)
2001 - Father seeks to "terminate' all rights of mother's" and move with the child out of the area. His reason for custody: mother smoked, allowed the child to drink soda, mother engaged in online computer use, at times entering adult oriented chatrooms, he claims mother engaged in online sex talk and lastly, mother and her current husband argue verbally in front of children and allowed the child to watch American Pie 2.
(hidden reasoning-he needed a tax dependant and I ended our affair/going back to my husband)
MEDIATOR: (god this women was awesome, but never met up with her again)
Her recommendations: This mediator did not allow the parents to engage in word-warfare. Therefore, the parents came to an agreement.
1. father & mother share legal custody
2.father's address to be used as primary address for custodial purposes
3.mother shall have daily visitation from 2:30-5:30pm, alternating weekends, shared holidays
4. mother will not smoke in child's presence when he is with her
5..etc,...etc..
2002--(9 months after above set orders) father attempted to entise mother to engage in somewhat of another sexual affair with him..mother told him those days were over. Father gets pissed, files for full custody again along with the exact same asking in the 2001 filing of his.
Mother doesn't want to lose child, so she begins divorce proceedings against her husband of 16 yrs due to the alleged domestic violence within the home (only verbal towards me though), now only buys Gatorade for the kids to drink reduse smoking habit to 3-4 cigerattes a day, smoking only outside. Deletes her playful screen name and never again returns to the chatroom stuff.
Mediator: Mother happens to know this mediator's daughter on a personal basis and let's just say her daughter wasn't all that popular, i think i rubbed her the wrong way, regardless, her findings were.
1. shared legal custody
2.sole physical custody to father
3.mother now only gets 1 day visition during the week, alternating weekends, shared holidays
4. 10 sessions of therapy to address engagin in online computer use and socialization enhancement
5.stop smoking for at least 3 months
All that so orderd in 11/02...since that date
Father changes towns of residency with child. not informing mother of moving until after he's done so, changed the child's school of attendance..again not telling her..making sure to only enroll child in activities that occur during her visitation time, making himself the coach..STILL making attempts to be with mother (which by now i consider sexual harrassment, which then caused break down of co-parenting) placing the child out of town on my visitation and then claiming i agreed to it.
Mother meets another male in 2003..begins dating him..in which sends the Father over the edge to act out against her. Mother ends up marrying the man. Father must really feel threatened because he really begins to cause problems in every direction for child and mother to even have a relationship.
2005-- mother has had enough..I figured with father violating every aspect of the current orders over and over, with documented proof, finally i could get my son and end this drama with him.
Mediator: a male this time around
Mediator had to seperate the both of us because i just can't stand being in the same room as the father, he makes me feel threatened that he will take my son and run, as well as all the little crap he's been doing affects my son and i...so, therefore mediator meets with us at different times..refuses to take or see any proof i showed up with because father wasn't present, so therefore he could not acceopt it.
Father and mediator; he accepts letters i had to father making attempts to get him knock off making unilateral decisions on things and confer with me 1st. but those letters were found to be demanding and argumentive, thus making me difficult to get along with, so claimed by father.
what was recommended:
1.share legal custody
2 father keeps physical
3.mother's visitation goes unchanged
4.smoking proven to be non-existent
5.12 sessions of therapy
6. enroll in co-parenting workshop
I was too afraid to go to court this morning, emotions got the best of me as did the father and of me not understanding what the f__k is going on here, if court is anything like mediation, i'm terrified in which I chickened out in going to hearing.
I'm afraid to talk to my son, but I warned him this might happen to me...he's 11 yrs old and is fully aware of what his father has been doing to me, because he has busted him at doing some things against me. i will talk to him, when i know I won't get upset and start to cry again. As far as hating the father, you betcha!! But, iam forced to share that child, i just wish he'd stopped what he was doing and i'm pissed that he has lied with all the untruths he could tell about me, to do this to our son and get custody.
Can I prove such?? YES!! will the courts give me the time of day?? NOOOOOOOOOO
ok...now,do i still sound like a horrible mother..it's so hard for me to explain and hard for me to even deal with..be understanding of it please
psss....i don't drive fast..good lord...i just feel rushed and panic trying to take care of my son's who attend two different school's, 23 miles apart, that get out at the same time..but since the father chooses to move from town to town..i have to follow for pick-up of my visitation.
Lemme try this one more time...giving those minor details I was telling you about.
Father: him
Mother: ME (yes, mother had an extra-marital affair, creating the child mentioned throughout--husband/wife and other man, came to terms with the ordeal and co-parented together)
2001 - Father seeks to "terminate' all rights of mother's" and move with the child out of the area. His reason for custody: mother smoked, allowed the child to drink soda, mother engaged in online computer use, at times entering adult oriented chatrooms, he claims mother engaged in online sex talk and lastly, mother and her current husband argue verbally in front of children and allowed the child to watch American Pie 2.
(hidden reasoning-he needed a tax dependant and I ended our affair/going back to my husband)
MEDIATOR: (god this women was awesome, but never met up with her again)
Her recommendations: This mediator did not allow the parents to engage in word-warfare. Therefore, the parents came to an agreement.
1. father & mother share legal custody
2.father's address to be used as primary address for custodial purposes
3.mother shall have daily visitation from 2:30-5:30pm, alternating weekends, shared holidays
4. mother will not smoke in child's presence when he is with her
5..etc,...etc..
2002--(9 months after above set orders) father attempted to entise mother to engage in somewhat of another sexual affair with him..mother told him those days were over. Father gets pissed, files for full custody again along with the exact same asking in the 2001 filing of his.
Mother doesn't want to lose child, so she begins divorce proceedings against her husband of 16 yrs due to the alleged domestic violence within the home (only verbal towards me though), now only buys Gatorade for the kids to drink reduse smoking habit to 3-4 cigerattes a day, smoking only outside. Deletes her playful screen name and never again returns to the chatroom stuff.
Mediator: Mother happens to know this mediator's daughter on a personal basis and let's just say her daughter wasn't all that popular, i think i rubbed her the wrong way, regardless, her findings were.
1. shared legal custody
2.sole physical custody to father
3.mother now only gets 1 day visition during the week, alternating weekends, shared holidays
4. 10 sessions of therapy to address engagin in online computer use and socialization enhancement
5.stop smoking for at least 3 months
All that so orderd in 11/02...since that date
Father changes towns of residency with child. not informing mother of moving until after he's done so, changed the child's school of attendance..again not telling her..making sure to only enroll child in activities that occur during her visitation time, making himself the coach..STILL making attempts to be with mother (which by now i consider sexual harrassment, which then caused break down of co-parenting) placing the child out of town on my visitation and then claiming i agreed to it.
Mother meets another male in 2003..begins dating him..in which sends the Father over the edge to act out against her. Mother ends up marrying the man. Father must really feel threatened because he really begins to cause problems in every direction for child and mother to even have a relationship.
2005-- mother has had enough..I figured with father violating every aspect of the current orders over and over, with documented proof, finally i could get my son and end this drama with him.
Mediator: a male this time around
Mediator had to seperate the both of us because i just can't stand being in the same room as the father, he makes me feel threatened that he will take my son and run, as well as all the little crap he's been doing affects my son and i...so, therefore mediator meets with us at different times..refuses to take or see any proof i showed up with because father wasn't present, so therefore he could not acceopt it.
Father and mediator; he accepts letters i had to father making attempts to get him knock off making unilateral decisions on things and confer with me 1st. but those letters were found to be demanding and argumentive, thus making me difficult to get along with, so claimed by father.
what was recommended:
1.share legal custody
2 father keeps physical
3.mother's visitation goes unchanged
4.smoking proven to be non-existent
5.12 sessions of therapy
6. enroll in co-parenting workshop
I was too afraid to go to court this morning, emotions got the best of me as did the father and of me not understanding what the f__k is going on here, if court is anything like mediation, i'm terrified in which I chickened out in going to hearing.
I'm afraid to talk to my son, but I warned him this might happen to me...he's 11 yrs old and is fully aware of what his father has been doing to me, because he has busted him at doing some things against me. i will talk to him, when i know I won't get upset and start to cry again. As far as hating the father, you betcha!! But, iam forced to share that child, i just wish he'd stopped what he was doing and i'm pissed that he has lied with all the untruths he could tell about me, to do this to our son and get custody.
Can I prove such?? YES!! will the courts give me the time of day?? NOOOOOOOOOO
ok...now,do i still sound like a horrible mother..it's so hard for me to explain and hard for me to even deal with..be understanding of it please
psss....i don't drive fast..good lord...i just feel rushed and panic trying to take care of my son's who attend two different school's, 23 miles apart, that get out at the same time..but since the father chooses to move from town to town..i have to follow for pick-up of my visitation.
stealth2
Under the Radar Member
Considering you saw fit to discuss this with your child tells me that the mediator was completely correct in suggesting therapy. It would appear that you may not have a clear view of what is in your son's best interests.
However, it doesn't matter what I think. What matters is that someone who was apparently ordered by the court to make recommendations thought it would be useful before entertaining your request for a change in custody. It's pretty stupid to blow that off because YOU don't think you need it.
(edit) and p.s. this is a prime example of why it's foolish to try and represent yourself in court. Get a lawyer and quit the shenanigans.
However, it doesn't matter what I think. What matters is that someone who was apparently ordered by the court to make recommendations thought it would be useful before entertaining your request for a change in custody. It's pretty stupid to blow that off because YOU don't think you need it.
(edit) and p.s. this is a prime example of why it's foolish to try and represent yourself in court. Get a lawyer and quit the shenanigans.
Last edited:
A final Note:
I would hope you re-read the Legal advice given to you here .
If you truly were suppose to be heard by a Judge this time , you present the FACTS , no emotional - no hateful comments . Be calm cool and collective with the straight forward FACTS ( no rambling long stories ) .
If the issue with school travel is overbearing , that's what modifications to orders are for .
Both Parents HAVE to give a little , the Court will see to it " For the Best Interest Of The Child(ren ) ."
Excuses can only go so far ,then they get worn out ... Excellent advice once again , Consult a Family Law Lawyer .
I would hope you re-read the Legal advice given to you here .
If you truly were suppose to be heard by a Judge this time , you present the FACTS , no emotional - no hateful comments . Be calm cool and collective with the straight forward FACTS ( no rambling long stories ) .
If the issue with school travel is overbearing , that's what modifications to orders are for .
Both Parents HAVE to give a little , the Court will see to it " For the Best Interest Of The Child(ren ) ."
Excuses can only go so far ,then they get worn out ... Excellent advice once again , Consult a Family Law Lawyer .
stealth2
Under the Radar Member
Also, with the (school) transportation - does your town use school busses? I also have a 13yo, and he's more than responsible enough to take the bus home, unlock the front door, let the dogs out, prepare himself a snack, and start on homework if I'm not home. That might ease your pick-up rush.
First of all, Im sorry your ex is an A$$... however, most of us have our ex A$$'s to deal with... it goes with the territory, you won't find many people around here who have the perfect ex...With that said, there are a couple things I wanted to comment on...
Another thing you said was
Of course they won't listen to you if you aren't there... they can't even hear you if you aren't there.
Four or so years ago, I petitioned the courts for a visitation change, I wanted to go from reasonable to a set visitation for my ex. He didn't show up, and the judge ordered that until he proved he DESERVED to see our children, he didn't need to and took my ex's visitation away.
I sat my then 7 and 6 year olds down, and told them daddy needed to see the judge so he could take them again, they were cool with that, b/c they hadn't seen him in a while anyway, but I wanted them to be prepared.
Fast forward several months, I come home from work to world war three, with my daughter screeching about me taking her dad from her, somehow she had ended up on the phone with her dad(Im still not sure who called who), who told her I wouldn't let her see him... I had to once again sit her down, I told her, in more detail what happened at court. I told her what the judge said daddy needed to do to see them, and that I never said a word(I did have a lawyer) I also told her, which was true then, and will be true till the day I die, " There is NO way on earth anyone would EVER tell me I cant see you, I would move heaven and earth before that happened. And would fight with everything I have, and then some."
I meant it, I don't care how scared I am, hell, it is intimidating even if you are holding ALL the cards, there are a couple people on this forum who know me and can tell you, with him being 30 thousand behind in support, and not having paid anything since October, and having done jailtime numerous times, how scared I still get the day of a court date. But I wouldn't DREAM of not showing up.
I don't see where you have alot of room to complain at this point, you had your day in court, and didn't bother going. In the future, let me echo, "Get a lawyer!" it helps with the nerves, that is for sure...
Also, everyone could stand a little therapy sometimes... there is nothing wrong with needing a trained outside source to talk to, to have listen, to help teach you how to handle life when it gets rough...
ok, my rant is over now.
UHM, you didn't SHOW up, what did you think would happen?
Another thing you said was
Honey, you HAD your day in court, and once again, you DIDN'T SHOW UP!
Of course they won't listen to you if you aren't there... they can't even hear you if you aren't there.
Four or so years ago, I petitioned the courts for a visitation change, I wanted to go from reasonable to a set visitation for my ex. He didn't show up, and the judge ordered that until he proved he DESERVED to see our children, he didn't need to and took my ex's visitation away.
I sat my then 7 and 6 year olds down, and told them daddy needed to see the judge so he could take them again, they were cool with that, b/c they hadn't seen him in a while anyway, but I wanted them to be prepared.
Fast forward several months, I come home from work to world war three, with my daughter screeching about me taking her dad from her, somehow she had ended up on the phone with her dad(Im still not sure who called who), who told her I wouldn't let her see him... I had to once again sit her down, I told her, in more detail what happened at court. I told her what the judge said daddy needed to do to see them, and that I never said a word(I did have a lawyer) I also told her, which was true then, and will be true till the day I die, " There is NO way on earth anyone would EVER tell me I cant see you, I would move heaven and earth before that happened. And would fight with everything I have, and then some."
I meant it, I don't care how scared I am, hell, it is intimidating even if you are holding ALL the cards, there are a couple people on this forum who know me and can tell you, with him being 30 thousand behind in support, and not having paid anything since October, and having done jailtime numerous times, how scared I still get the day of a court date. But I wouldn't DREAM of not showing up.
I don't see where you have alot of room to complain at this point, you had your day in court, and didn't bother going. In the future, let me echo, "Get a lawyer!" it helps with the nerves, that is for sure...
Also, everyone could stand a little therapy sometimes... there is nothing wrong with needing a trained outside source to talk to, to have listen, to help teach you how to handle life when it gets rough...
ok, my rant is over now.
Ooooook, ...I see why you guys are missing the point, as to why the therapy was ordered by the mediator. Good lord, my fault. (keeping in mind, my not showing up in court is bothering me cause i've been up all night and i feel totally numb and scared)
Ok this is the REASON FOR ORDERED THERAPY:
The Father showed the mediator copies of about 5 "letters of demand", whereas I'm demanding the Father to STOP violating my joint legal rights to participate is decisions made regarding schooling or changing thereof, enrollment into therapy.
Demanded he tell me at least 20 days prior to making residency moves without first notifying me.
Discuss any/all enrollements into any sport programs with me before doing so and what months they would take place in.
To immed. stop the changing of my visitation times and days without my consent.
The letters were dated roughly from August 2004-March2005, whereas he was violating one thing after another, I couldn't keep up with him.
The letters were anywhere from 3-7 pages long in nature.
Then to conclude it all ..he refused to not stop causing kaos, I then sent him new courts orders with a letter stating, he should sign them because he is out of control and he could chance losing his son, if I took him back to court for these violations.
Direct quote from mediator:
" the mother's letters to the father seem to be argumentive, confrontational, demanding and somewhat threatening. In contrast the father struck this mediator as calm and reasonable, although difficult issues were being raised." Thus the need for therapy to discuss mother's feelings regarding the father as well as, enrollment in co-parenting education.
That's what I had said..Why do I need Therapy? so the next time he violates my joint legal rights and changes my visitation times..I can 'smile' and say that's ok?
Ok this is the REASON FOR ORDERED THERAPY:
The Father showed the mediator copies of about 5 "letters of demand", whereas I'm demanding the Father to STOP violating my joint legal rights to participate is decisions made regarding schooling or changing thereof, enrollment into therapy.
Demanded he tell me at least 20 days prior to making residency moves without first notifying me.
Discuss any/all enrollements into any sport programs with me before doing so and what months they would take place in.
To immed. stop the changing of my visitation times and days without my consent.
The letters were dated roughly from August 2004-March2005, whereas he was violating one thing after another, I couldn't keep up with him.
The letters were anywhere from 3-7 pages long in nature.
Then to conclude it all ..he refused to not stop causing kaos, I then sent him new courts orders with a letter stating, he should sign them because he is out of control and he could chance losing his son, if I took him back to court for these violations.
Direct quote from mediator:
" the mother's letters to the father seem to be argumentive, confrontational, demanding and somewhat threatening. In contrast the father struck this mediator as calm and reasonable, although difficult issues were being raised." Thus the need for therapy to discuss mother's feelings regarding the father as well as, enrollment in co-parenting education.
That's what I had said..Why do I need Therapy? so the next time he violates my joint legal rights and changes my visitation times..I can 'smile' and say that's ok?
stealth2
Under the Radar Member
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHY THE F*CK THE MEDIATOR RECOMMENDED THERAPY! That's what you're not getting. The mediator said that he feels it would be beneficial to you. That's what the judge is going to read, then ask you "Ms Kirk - have you done anything about attending therapy sessions as Mediator suggested?" You have three choices.
a. "Yes, Your Honor, I have started therapy with XYZ."
b. "Yes, Your Honor. While I have not yet started sessions, I have determined which therapists are covered under my insurance and have an appointment to begin with XYZ on abc date."
c. "No, Your Honor. I don't need therapy, it's all because my ex has ..... blah blah blah."
You want to see your kid more than you do now? GET YOUR BLEEDING A$$ TO A THERAPIST! OR QUIT WHINING ABOUT HOW UNFAIR LIFE IS.
a. "Yes, Your Honor, I have started therapy with XYZ."
b. "Yes, Your Honor. While I have not yet started sessions, I have determined which therapists are covered under my insurance and have an appointment to begin with XYZ on abc date."
c. "No, Your Honor. I don't need therapy, it's all because my ex has ..... blah blah blah."
You want to see your kid more than you do now? GET YOUR BLEEDING A$$ TO A THERAPIST! OR QUIT WHINING ABOUT HOW UNFAIR LIFE IS.
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